2015 Rulebook Proposals

Discussion in 'Rule Book Proposals' started by Andrew Marles, Nov 26, 2014.

  1. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    Andrew, I want to clarify and expand on my thoughts regarding our intermediate pace riders.

    Sportsman is a great "stepping stone" to the faster classes but fast novice and intermediate riders will DQ making them ineligible for the class. MotoTT is the right class for these riders but it's the only race they will be competitive in and have a trophy opportunity.

    Using intermediate riders for expert grid filler when some may never reach that level is somewhat unfair. My thinking is not to have a separate MotoTT race with maybe 6 bikes and to use that track time for a second Superbike race.

    Based on last season's big bike numbers and if they return there should be sufficient numbers for separate expert and intermediate groups (MotoTT rules for intermediates) for OSS, Superbike and Formula Ultra. A combined grid of 10+ bikes is pretty decent and an efficient use of track time. This would be 3 championship classes for the intermediate riders instead of 1 making it much more interesting and fun for them. If 1 group falls below 5 bikes there would be no scoring for that group unless there's special dispensation while we rebuild these classes.

    The bump-up class could be 600 production if there's sufficient bikes to justify this class with intermediate grid filler.

    I'm sure our EMRA friends would appreciate the above class structure for the continuation of the WCC as noted by Shane. It may also encourage some of our intermediate riders to visit Edmonton to race their peers.

    Just food for thought and discussion from an intermediate rider's perspective....
     
  2. Schoey

    Schoey New Member

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    Suggestion for Formula Ultra:
    I would like to reduce the amount of laps for Formula Ultra to 7-8 laps instead of 15. i have a feeling that some riders don't enter this class because it's nearing the end of the day and don't want to be out there for 15 laps in one session.

    Pro's of reducing laps to 7-8 laps:
    -less stress on your body nearing the end of the day= safer
    -less chance of riders being lapped= safer
    -encouragement to ride this class by not being lapped
    -allows another session on the track due to reduced time
    -lap time range can be expanded because there less chance of being lapped with less laps

    Con's of reducing laps to 7-8 laps:
    -the 6 riders that enter get less riding time

    The questions I have are:
    If Formula Ultra laps were reduced to 7-8 laps, would you enter?
    Even if you or your bike don't qualify for Formula Ultra, how many laps of racing do you like in one session and why?
     
  3. jcathie

    jcathie Member

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    Rob, make it a poll and let the (entirely unscientific) results guide the Rules Committee.
     
  4. ryno11

    ryno11 New Member

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    Was Formula Ultra not created to make it the wmrc's premier class. If you reduce laps, you might as well cancel the class and revert back to Superbike being the premier class( as it should be imo)
     
  5. Dean Thompson

    Dean Thompson New Member

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    Great idea, it's usually a snoozer anyways. Maybe two guys actually racing with the rest strung out for a 15 lap "practice session". IMO.
     
  6. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    I would enter Formula Ultra if I had other bikes to race with. If able to score meaningful points as suggested for intermediate riders it would be a no brainer.

    As with all the faster classes the bikes seem to split in to several groups spread around the track. As a back marker you are wondering when the front runners are going to rip by you so keep your lines as predictable as possible. Being lapped is probably more of a negative for the passing riders than the back markers.

    A 10 lap race seems to be a good number. However, 8 or less laps might be better given the average age of our membership. I have even heard the younger guys say they wish there were less laps at the halfway point of races - seeing the crossed flags is often bittersweet, especially at the end of the day. Reducing the number of laps (maybe for all races) but having more races could be better.

    Less laps per race:
    Pros
    - Faster more intense races/lap
    - More races - Formula Ultra X2?
    - Less tired riders hence safer and more entries
    - Tighter racing with pack being less spread out on track
    - Less back markers
    - Better schedule with shorter rest periods between races
    - More exciting for spectators
    Cons
    - Less time for riders gridded at the back to work their way through the pack
    - Less efficient use of track time due to logistics of pre-grid, starting, timing etc. of each race - need to determine optimum number of laps so we don't lose track time
     
  7. ryno11

    ryno11 New Member

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    But that is the whole point of a race being the premier race. It is supposed to be difficult. You shouldn't look at the half way flag as being bitter sweet, but as a wake up call that you have killed half the laps and have to either make that pass, or gap the guy behind you. Its not very often you can or should see the winner of the premier race looking fresh as a daisy after a race win. Guys train physically to beable to not only finish these races but be competitive. I know in a 8 lap sprint race I am golden at then end. You ad in another 4 laps and I am gassed at the end!
     
  8. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    I totally agree... we have some very fit and good racers who could probably do 20 laps no problem. I was just responding to ways to increase our ridership in the big bike classes.
     
  9. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    I suggest more races/day for Novice Open because they sit around all day waiting to race. They should have at least 3 x 7 lap races/day to make their day worthwhile and better value. Also, often these riders are new to big bikes and racing so more frequent races helps keep them "in the game" so to speak. If we proceed with a mentoring program as suggested this would allow for more feedback from mentors to improving rider skill, safety and retention. Pit space could be reserved to ensure novice riders can pit with their mentors.

    I question Novice Open being a championship class due to the many unsafe maneuvers and falls I witnessed last season. Also, the fastest novice riders (usually the point leaders) get moved up quickly. It might be more meaningful for the novice rider rep with input from the mentors to decide on awards for the most skilled riders versus the fastest. This would put more emphasis on skill rather than taking unnecessary chances and falling or taking other riders out. We want novice riders to have a great time, not get hurt, return the next race weekend/season and feed the big bike classes.
     
  10. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    It would be nice to know how many 250 riders intend to move up to bigger bikes next season. At other tracks the small bike riders seem to move up after a season or two but the opposite seems more the case for us. It's definitely best for new racers to start on small bikes to develop their skills but there must be factors such as cost (as duly noted by Dean Drolet) that stop them from moving up. It could also be the larger grids of varying skill levels and that they are just great fun!

    The small bike growth in numbers and classes is awesome along with more track time for them.... just need more of them to move up and sell their bikes to the newbies. It might take some real "out of the box" thinking to reverse this trend and preserve our premier classes. Would like to hear ideas from small and big bike riders on this.
     
  11. Schoey

    Schoey New Member

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    if a racer/rider requires a visual aid to drive according to their provincial/state drivers licence, they shall be required to use appropriate visual aid while riding/racing.
     
  12. cookie

    cookie Two Smokin'

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    I think this is a good addition, a no brainer
     
  13. Dean Thompson

    Dean Thompson New Member

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    I've raced many bikes around Mission over the years; VFR750, R6, VTR1000, SV650, CBR600, R1 and ZZR250. Honestly the 250 class has revived my interest enough to continuing racing Mission. It's the most fun I've had racing around the small track. If I raced California tracks like Thunderhill I'd stay on a big bike, but a short, tight track like Mission is so much fun on the little bikes. Don't think of it as just a newbie class :scooter: .
     
  14. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    There's no doubt a 250 is an excellent choice for any racer at Mission - it's the bike of choice for some very fast ex big bike racers. Although not that fast I'm keen to try one myself.

    What I was trying to say is a 250 is a great bike to learn on before racing a big bike. I thought at least some 250 riders would want to ride a bigger bike after "cutting their teeth" on a 250. As it happens there seems to be more riders looking to downsize like you - probably for the same reasons.

    As popular as the small bikes are (thank you Scotty) I still think we should support rider progression to maintain our existing big bike classes and have rules in place to encourage this. Our membership will obviously choose via their bike choice and budget - the club will have to adjust accordingly.
     
  15. cookie

    cookie Two Smokin'

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    Is there any chance that a mod could separate this thread into separate threads/discussions for each proposed rule change? Another month in this thread and stuff will be lost.
     
  16. Ryan Whittle

    Ryan Whittle Rider of Orange V-Twins

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    Could I ask that there be a new thread for each proposal? It will be almost impossible to navigate through all of the proposals and multiple conversations in one thread.

    I would also suggest that the person posting either refer to an existing section of the rulebook (with paragraph reference), or sugget which paragraph it goes under. Suggestion should also state the desired outcome (increased participation, closer competition, safety). Your perceived pros/cons should also be included. This way, when the rulebook committee meets, we can discuss each proposal and include the committee's recommendation on the topic.
     
  17. HWY99

    HWY99 Team Green

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    Organizing the rule suggestions better is a great idea. As much as this thread has grown quite quickly the Rules Committee needs to hear from more of our 60+ active members. From my experience decisions can be made with the best of intentions that don't reflect what the silent majority really want moving forward. With our new Executive and lots of enthusiastic members this is a great opportunity to provide input to help improve our club. Please feel free to offer your suggestions because the Rules Committee wants your feedback!

    Dean Drolet mentioned that many members don't check the forum or FB limiting feedback and effective communication with them. I'm assuming they at least check the website for their schedule and stats? Once the Rules Committee has the recommended rule changes organized I suggest posting them on the website for review by the membership. Feedback from the membership could be by email/phone to the Rules Committee before final review and implementation by the Executive. Any thoughts on this and other ideas on how to better communicate with our club members?
     
  18. Dean Thompson

    Dean Thompson New Member

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    I think the new executive is quite diligent in checking the clubs social media chatter. They are all pretty nerdy. :thumbup:
     
  19. Ryan Whittle

    Ryan Whittle Rider of Orange V-Twins

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    I think the concern is that it's only the vocal minority on social media, rather than a representative population of the membership as a whole.
     
  20. Dean Thompson

    Dean Thompson New Member

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    You can't pull hens teeth. Many members are happy to be unassociated with the club, other than just show up on race day, pay, race and go home.
     

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