WTF is happening to WMRC?

You guys all know I still bleed WMRC, but I have a few thoughts I would like to see the exec's address if you guys don't think I'm rocking the boat.

Out of all the issues over the years regarding costs/riders/noise/politics that are a constant, there are some that never really seem to be dealt with. I have asked/cajoled/badgered just about every Prez with the exception of Ryan over race entry fees, and with the exception of the Al Beck tenure it has been a constant thorn in the side of our club. Why is it every board of exec's seem to think we're charging fees that actually encourage riders to come out? Dean Thompson and I talked the last race of the year and for what it cost Deano to race one race in my mind we're flat out giving it to him right up the hoop to race with us. Not only Deano, but any rider who wants to race only one race.

Am I the only one who sees how small our grids have become? I'd rather we charged smaller fees and used that to bring in more racers instead of what I perceive as punishing the ones who come to the track. What's better? 20 bikes on the grid at $50 bucks a class, or 10 bikes at $100? In the Lower Mainland we only have X amount of racers, we're never going to get WMMRA or OMRRA guys back up here, so it's time to dangle that carrot for our local supporters, or we inch that much closer to life support.

And the argument that we're priced along the lines of the other clubs holds no water anymore. Does anyone see increased grids with any of the other clubs? It's time to become the definitive club for adjusting for reality. Look at just our track MRP, the drag race numbers are down, the dorks car club wouldn't exist if they didn't make money by running, he hah ha ha, sorry, managing the track to cover their costs, but are they dropping their entry fees? No, so they too will suffer another year of existing and nothing more. If we don't get a break on the track rental fees this upcoming year maybe it is time to just tell them to GF'ed. It they can't rent the track why punish us? How much did they charge us to change our last race date? Wouldn't our membership love to know how much they make off of our back on rentals? I too know where some skeletons are and if I'm ever backed into a corner I'd have nothing to lose letting some of the dirt I know out.

Vendors, whose bright idea was it to come up with exorbitant fees to encourage them? For all the ideas I have personally heard about bringing people in most of them have vanished like my shot at racing GP's. Drop the fees for a token space rental, let anyone from the antique sellers to leather vendors to set up shop, with a bit of luck if the attendance for the vendors alone works it works for the club's kitty, God knows we have the space in the pits. Same economics here, what's better? Some return for extra vendors, or no return, and lots of empty space in the parking lot?

And although I still have fellow riders/friends in the club who scoff at the idea, comp some of our more dependable volunteer racers to become in essence paid volunteers. It logically costs the club nothing for what we get back in work. Look at what the Squids did for the club when we were comping them, Richie and the boys still mean a lot to me after all these years, they busted their asses and earned every race we gave them. We still have a hard time convincing volunteers to be part of the action, I'm not talking cornerworkers, I mean the meat and bones jobs of this club. I'm pretty convinced we have riders who have never come back after the fiasco of the forced volunteer idea. There has to be a certain amount of riders who would come back just because they didn't have to do bales. I hate people who don't volunteer more than anyone, but we can't force them, and every year we see more friends/racer volunteers suffering terminal burnout from a lack of help. I see this in every club I work with and people I talk to. We need dedicated people, and in my mind it's a fiscal offset.

I do like the idea of bringing Sportsman back, but it never should have left or become a points gathering series. When that class was first introduced I vividly remember sweating each rider at registration to ride it, and Rick Johnson not letting me ride in it because the grids got too big. Ask Marbod how much fun that class was at the time. It was just a spirited fun free for all, and a huge money maker for the club.

And there still is no cheap one off fun class to offer. When we have top drawer 250's on the track it kind of defeats the purpose doesn't it? Dave Collis also gets big points from me for being the only racer to actually buy a Honda CBR125 when we floated the idea of racing them. Those things are fu%^&ng worthless now to buy, but I don't see anyone at our club trying to find a class like this to run. We need a claimer/cheap ass/beater bike $40 entry fee class to save the club. Have Nikola and Ricky set out some basic rules, and sit back and smile. I know Nikola and Rick gave me hell for suggesting a beater bike class years ago for fear of having leaky, shaky, old pieces of crap on the track but hey, vintage gets away with it at most tracks............

I wander in and out of the club, and I have been guilty of leaving when politics became too much but I have had more fun, more good times, and more laughs than the next ten racers put together and I am extremely saddened by what i see going on with my WMRC.

Should our mandate be trying to make racing affordable now, instead of making the club barely survive with the way it is now? Please don't list daily costs, we all know them off by heart by now, but until we have fifty new racers lining up we're still going to be the club who barely makes it by with 65 racers.

Guess this is more of a ranty viewpoint (sorry to use your trademark Bernie), but I think I raise some valid points here. I feel for Scottie here walking into the Lion's den that is the new Presidental office, but with his enthusiasm I see good things for the club, but I don't want to see good things, I want to see better things.

:2cents

 

Some good points Ted. I too believe in paid positions for the regular "semi-pro" volunteers we get at most race days.

The vendor topic is a good one too. A friend of mine who's a local businessman had agreed to support our racing with product contingency. I spent allot of time working out the details of the program before he agreed. I then approached the club with the idea and instead of an excited "right on!" reception, I got "that'll be a $700 vendors fee". I asked the distributor (and I felt like a real arsehole) if he'd be willing to pay it, and obviously he wasn't interested in spending $700 as well as giving racers contingency. So you're right, unless the club exec change their policy, we will continue to have only two vendors at our races.

 

Becauase I'm basically lazy, rather than write out my thoughts on sponsorship/vendors etc I'll just copy/paste from an e-mail I sent last year:

First, I think we need a central list of all motorcycle shops, dealers, riding schools, clubs etc. Everyone involved in the motorcycle industry. The list should include phone and e-mail contacts and contact names. I'll start to put together a list of those I know.

Second, I think we should have a price list for potential advertisers, outlining in basic terms what we can offer them. I think it should include, just off the top of my head:

Class sponsorship
Title sponsorship per event
Program advertising
Website sponsorship/advertising
Event banner advertising
Trackside vendor packages per event/season
Reciprocal advertising

We shouldn't bundle everything together, more of a menu a sponsor can choose from. A class sponsorship is a little less without a vendor booth, but you can get a vendor booth without a class sponsorship if you get my drift. No one wants to feel like they're paying for something they won't use.

Some of these things can be negotiated as a combined package. For example a dealer or manufacturer could buy a title sponsorship for say $750. They want to add a vendor booth to showcase some bikes, maybe that's another $150. so $900. They offer to advertise for us on their website or mentions in a print ad for some period of time leading up to their event so we credit back say $100. The numbers are pulled out of my butt but I'm sure you get where I'm going.

Offering a full menu of options from season long class sponsorships to small one time program ads gives more options to potential sponsors/advertisers to try it out and see if it works for them.

I don't know how much work would be involved, but if the website could have a front page that was basically a version of the race poster with the title sponsor changed leading up to each event I think that would add a lot of value to a potential advertiser.

If we were to make a mock-up of a poster with potential advertisers names on them ahead of time that someone could take into the dealerships and show them as a sales tool before the season started it would be a tangible thing they could hold in their hand when making a decision.

I dunno, lots of ideas and no time to implement probably LOL.

Tony

 

The pricing is based on covering our daily track costs. Right now, PER DAY, when we take into account track rental, paid staff (yes we still have some of those), ambulance, lunch for volunteers and staff, insurance, etc it takes roughly $8500 per day. with the average 38 riders we do get that makes for $225 per rider to break even. If we were to lower fees, how many days can the WMRC survive to hopefully get more riders in as we subsidize the riders? That's VERY risky and a bit of that "if you build it, they will come" strategy. It's based on dreams and not very fiscally responsible to the paying members of the club. Trust me, the WMRC is constantly looking at ways to lower fees.

So, what you are suggesting is that "if you don't lower the fees, we will not race"? How does that benefit the racers? So then they will give some weekends away to those who want them. Not a good long term strategy. BTW, at their last meeting we were privy to their treasurer talking about track fees, etc. It was eye opening, and believe it or not, while we are major renters, we only account for less than 1/4 of their rental income. That's not a good position to try to demand stuff. If we were greater than 50%, then yes.

Why don't you bring this up as a formal proposal to our promotions team. Let them know where to setup the vendor area, etc. However, not many people that I know will pay $10 to see a vendor.

Perhaps I should let Ryan Whittle answer this one, but that strategy almost bankrupted the club. We were fucked beyond belief after doing just that.

Let's face it. Motorcycle racing is bloody expensive. Depending on the bike, you either have to be mechanically inclined and race vintage (do your own work), or you pay a pretty penny race. The 250 series is doing a lot to bring those costs down, but with disposable income not really being the reality at this time, that strategy will bury the club faster than giving our bank account number to hackers. What we really need are people who not self-entitled. Far too many of our racers have the following excuses:
I did setup, so I don't need to do tear down
I have to work
I have a family I need to get back to
I have to take a ferry so I can't do setup/teardown
I don't want to (Very few ever admit this)
I have a party to get to
etc
etc
etc
Shall I go on? Everyone's got a bloody excuse, but those of us who actually do the work, just do it. We give up all those things above. Don't get me started on that, or I'll blow up.

Ted, we have 40 racers, not 65. I've already quoted the costs. You tell us the magic formula to make it all work? I hope your math is better than mine in all this. Also remember that we have aging equipment that needs to be replaced in the next year or two. I estimate a new timing system and 2 or 3 new laptops as well as a new printer to bring the club close to $10k that it has to make instead of subsidizing racers. Figure out a way to make that happen, and then direct those who will do the work to also make it so. That's what we've all been trying to do, but seriously, all people do is find holes and complain and never really offer real thought out solutions.

I'll end my rant to your rant now.

 

Let's be proud of our assets($70,000 in air fence and $15,000 in containers).Thanks to the 2006-now executive.

 

If I show up at the track early enough from Vancouver Island (4+ hour trip) I help set up. I know you talk shit about me and Jeff (anyone else?) who need to leave to catch a ferry (which adds $200+ to my race day btw), but believe me, I'd rather be a local racer (i.e. Vancouver area) and be able to stay after the races to have a beer, tear down air fence and talk about racing than have to fight through traffic for 2 hours to maybe make my reservation and luckily get home by 1am. Maybe think about that before you bad mouth me for the "ferry excuse" again.

 

What can I say. I give what I can. I'm trying to do it all and frankly it's got to give somewhere. I consider myself lucky enough to still be able to come out and race.

 

Again as a non member looking into racing at mission simply to get track time it just doesnt add up, the 450 plus race course, i think someone stated 130 for two 10 lap novice races plus being voluntold into helping at club events. Time is my enemy, young fsmily, work and the rest of life gets in the way. I raced supermoto for a few years and loved it, still do, the cost are lower, but so are the venue and overall cost per day to the club by a large sum. I get that.

Realty is i can go ride at the ridge with orpt track days for 165, 80 there and back in my truck with a little for food, another in the truck to share fule costs or a few with a trailer and your laughing. They treated the canadians to 140 trackday in september, that cant be beat. Nothing to do but show up, ride 8- 20 minute sessions on an awesome track and go home with a smile.

How is wmrc gojng to encourage new racers or even old ones to return, i wish i had the answers. I will say this and it isnt intended to piss anyone off or upset anyone but when i have been to wmrc races and wcss trackdaze over the years there seems to be a seperation between the hardcore racers who are in it to win it and the track junkies who are there for fun and friendships. The friendliness or should i say snob attitude is very apparent with some, a small percentage i am sure. Again not trying to piss anyone off just giving an outside perspective of what others see. Like some club event with sm racing sometimes people take it seriously and it affects everyone. I equate it to beer league hockey in which guys think there are scouts in the stands, hack, trip and even fight, and for what, a trophy at the end of the year. I am guilty of this on occassion and it is easy to get sucked into this atmosphere.

No thanks track days for me again this year. I will come and watch a few wmrc events and see what if anything has changed, i hope your grids are bigger, best of luck to all and safe riding.

Ross

 

Dean, I've never spoken ill of you to anyone behind your back or to your face. Up until that comment, I thought we were friends. I was just expressing my frustration that people always have reasons why they cannot help. I wasn't stating the legitimacy of those reasons, of which, being in Comox adds quite a bit. However, those in Vic who didn't have another 3 hour drive once they are across, could certainly help. It was not meant as a slight to you or Jeff.

 

Ok sorry for my rant. My paranoia had me believing you were directing those comments at me. Sorry for my defensive reaction. Peace and love!

 

i think we are getting good value for the buck , motorcycle racing is not cheap and for me the biggest issue remains so many people don't know there is a road course at mission

right now we are fortunate to have something to race around on , the alternative of having to go south or east is a non starter for me except for the occasional trackday

we need to improve the profile of the club to get more interest from sponsors , new members and the general public , and how do we do that without resources ?

the club manages to get by every year thru the hardwork of unpaid volunteers , i think lowering track fees will not be what encourages more people to drop 5,10 or 15 thousand dollars on a racebike plus gear , developing a positive enviroment for newbs to come in and get a taste of racing and enjoy the comradarie is what i feel will improve things for the club

my 2 cents

 

My honest opinion is that we are not out of line in terms of race entry fees. The WMRC pricing model is setup to encourage racers to A) Start racing on less expensive (non 600 type bikes) and B) to race multiple classes. It is not setup to have someone on an SV riding one class.

Ted you mentioned Dean specifically that it is too expensive to run one class. While it is expensive for that first class ($85), the cost of each subsequent class is only $35. I don't know of too many clubs where you can have 2 morning practice sessions and 3 10 lap races for $155. That seems pretty reasonable IMO and is a reduction in cost from 2005.

With regards to Ross' comment, for a racing club, I don't think $95 is out of line for a 20 minute warm-up session and 2 10 lap races. As Andrew pointed out, I don't think that entry fees are the barrier to entry, it's the cost of running the bikes, which is why we continue to try and encourage racers to start on a ninja 250 and progress up the ladder. I would be willing to bet that if the entry fee for novice was reduced to $50 you wouldn't see a noticeable increase in racers.

The relatively insignificant nature of entry fees was driven home for me a few years ago when I tried to get more guys to enter Formula 40. Even though the entry fee was peanuts ($25 back then) the cost of fuel, tires and wear and tear on the bike had the riders declining to race.

I would love to be in a position where we could have a paid track setup/teardown crew. I would love to pay the starter, referee, timing and scoring, radio control, corner workers etc. I would love to be able to offer end of year race fee rebates based on # of classes entered, but the reality at this point is that it is not economically feasible. We can't go into race season's hoping that we sell enough race licenses to cover the track rental for the first weekend.

With regards to vendors, I still completely support the need to have some base level of sponsorship of the club to be able to vend on site. I don't recall a class sponsorship minimum of $700, but I could be wrong. If we don't require some minimum investment, what message are we sending to our existing vendors that rely on the WMRC to make a living? Do you think they would still sponsor the club if they didn't have to? Times are tough and you cut where you have to. I would be shocked if more people attended the track if there was a flea market. So what have you accomplished? You've pissed off supporters of the club AND decreased sponsorship revenue.

I'm not saying things cannot be improved, there is always room for improvement.

The above is my opinion, and my opinion only. I am not a member of the executive and do not purport to speak on their behalf.

Thanks,

Ryan

 

I'm not sure if this statement is in regards to my story, but I will give a more detailed account of what what happened and what I see as a poor decision by the club executive members I spoke with: April 2012 I had been in discussions with an old highschool friend who is a Vancouver area businessman. He started imported a high quality synthetic oil into Canada, so I thought I'd propose a way to help advertise the product as well as offering WMRC racers a bonus with a new contingency program. I did allot of leg work designing a program that would benefit all involved and even the businessman was supporting the proposal. I brought the proposal to the appropriate executives and, like I said earlier, was told there's a $750 vendors fee. I tried to explain that he's not a vendor, but a contingency prize provider so why would we charge him? No good answers came out of the discussion, just a pissed of racer (me) and a dumb struck potential supporter. I for one will not be taking on a project like that to help the club just to have it shot down without due process again.

PS. No vendor at WMRC events make a living from our 4 or 5 races per season.

 

Hi Dean, really sorry to hear about your experience. Sounds like there was some serious miscommunication.

The policy as I recall it is that if you want to sell your product at a WMRC event, you need to be a class sponsor. This would mean that if your friend wanted to setup a booth promoting his oil and selling it at WMRC events, he would need to sponsor a class. Class sponsorship gets you a lot more than just the ability to vend. Your able to post in the vendor section of the forum, announcing throughout the day, naming of said class (i.e. the Mobil 1 Formula Classic etc), banner ad on the website etc.

As I understand it, if your buddy wanted to provide a contingency program to WMRC racers, give away some free product and set up a display in your pit, there would be no charge from the WMRC. This is essentially how I recall Nancy/Jackie's Kimpex/Ipone sponsorship promotion worked. They didn't pay anything to the club. Now, if they wanted to set up a booth and sell CKX helmets, Ipone oil etc. they would need to sponsor a class etc.

I'm not 100% certain that is still the policy, but that's the way it was a few years ago. Hopefully that helps, and it is very regretable the club lost an opportunity that you presented.

 

Ryan, unfortunately you still run with the same perception over pricing that permeates every club now. It's not cheap to race, that's a given. But $85 for a first class, and the other associated fees don't even make it somewhat affordable. It goes back to having ten bikes on the grid at a given price, or twenty bikes at a reduced rate. Why not consider those who can afford it to pay for a complete series for the year, so we have an idea of projected revenue. Aren't you an accountant? I'm not, so I don't have all the answers but you posted an answer to one, we're still charging too much, and some of the racers I have spoken with still say as much. Read some of the forums out there, people have way less disposable income and if you look at us as a business, we're not exactly having the consumer/racer running to us anymore.

Just because you think we're priced in line with other clubs is not an answer, it's coming off the teleprompter. When the day comes that riders increase with steep costs I'll apologize, until then I'd bet more of the club would side with the idea of cheaper buy in, more racers. Where is it written that we can't be the club who dropped fees and the racers came back?

As for the vendors, you've opened that can of worms that has hung around WMRC for too long. Exclusivity has done zero for our club, and I'm speaking for myself and what I've seen over the years. Not one of the exec's could ever produce a compelling enough argument for me to say it has benefited our club. We don't need to air all the dirty laundry surrounding this topic, but we've never really encouraged any kind of vendor to participate, as some exec's saw fit to keep our pits closed for what appeared to a whole lot of people as bias, and as a conflict of interest. If you would like to carry on this particular topic in private you know how to get a hold of me.

I'd rather not get caught up in mud slinging, I want to see the club move forward and do more than survive. If as usual I've peed someone off, so be it. I'd rather be chewed for bringing up some valid points than just posting to read what I've put to paper.

To all past and present exec's I intend no malice, and I for one appreciate all the effort that each and every one of you has put in, but I think I'm still allowed to ask, or present a comment or thought regarding the club.

Happy Payday

 

Ted, we have a lot of laughs together, but I have to say you're off base on this one.

ctardi touched on the one salient point in that the cost of machinery far, far exceeds the cost of entry. If you examine what someone pays for a bike (even amortized over 3 to 5 years), tires, brakes, fuel, tire warmers, genny, transponder, easy-up, transport, food, lodging, storage, insurance, leathers, helmet, boots, gloves, etc., etc. it would quickly become obvious that the fixed costs borne by the racer far outweigh the entry fees charged by the club. Just off the top of my pointy head, I'd guesstimate that entry fees constitute less than 10% of the daily cost of racing.

Going by ctardi's numbers in his post, his entry fees ($361) are 6% of the cost ($6000) of his bike. That excludes all the ancillary costs I listed above. Lets say we cut the entry fees so he would have only paid $300 in entry fees. It would drop the cost to just 5%. Looking at it the other way, lets drop the price of the race bike by $1000. His $361 entry fees would be 7.2% of the cost of the bike. Still pretty miniscule in a race program for a hobby racer.

Ted, think back to your racing daze. How much money did you spend on the bike part of things and how much did you pay in entry fees? What percentage did the entry fees cost in your entire annual race budget?

Running cheaper (read 'slower') race bikes that don't burn through tires (or race gas) are the way to keep racing cheap and attract (and retain) racers.

Has anyone out there actually kept an accurate accounting of income and expenses from a race season?

 

I have a few thoughts:

First.....Ryan your response to Ross about $95 being 'in line' for a warm up and 2 races is not really the whole truth. After the medical fee the novice pays $130 out of his pocket for 3 on track sessions with a total of 46 to 48 minutes of riding time. As Ross pointed out those of us that went down to the Ridge paid $140 (on special promo) and between $160 and $185 regular price depending on the track day provider. Depending on the provider you get either 7 or 8 twenty minute sessions so either 140 or 160 minutes of riding time. Bang for the buck in terms of price versus riding time obviously the Ridge is a better deal. If you throw in the fact it is a better track and you don't have to do set up or take down it tilts further in the Ridge's favor.

Second......I think the club and the exec is looking at the financial picture from the wrong angle. Instead of scrimping and saving everywhere we can and trying to get enough money from entry fees etc. we should be looking for another way to put money into the clubs bank account which will allow the club to spend extra money on advertising, volunteer 'salaries', etc. If it is done correctly and is done twice a year we could even look at lowering entry fees.

Basically my idea is to do a BIG raffle where the club tries to raise $10K after all expenses. An example of prize breakdown could be: First prize Cal. Superbike School at a track of the winners choice, Second Prize a season pass of Track Daze at Mission, Third prize Star School at the Ridge, Fourth prize weekend in Whistler, Fifth prize $200 store credit somewhere. It will require some work organizing prizes, brochures, tickets and lottery license. It will also require effort from EVERY racer to sell tickets to make it a success but I think the payoff is well worth the effort.

I brought up my idea at the monthly meetings in the summer and the fall of 2011 and I even followed up with emails directly to the promotions team asking what was going on and if they needed help making it happen. They said several times that it was a good idea but did nothing. Finally after pointing out this failure to launch to Dean last winter he agreed the idea had merit and said lets try it but by that point there wasn't enough time to make it happen so that we would be able to sell tickets at the 2012 bike show. As far as I am aware nothing has been started yet again and therefore nothing will be ready for the 2013 bike show.

Third.....in 2011 and again at the beginning of 2012 I told the promotions department that I had a contact who could make us pretty much any kind of signage that the club wanted or needed for the cost of materials. I asked several times if we wanted banners, road signs, stickers, etc. and every time I was told that it sounded like a good thing but nothing happened.

Before anyone says 'we are a club of volunteers and we need people to make things happen' I will say that I was prepared to do some or most of the work to make both of my ideas happen. What I needed from the exec and promotions people was a little guidance and a little help that only they could provide (registration with BC lotteries, computerized logo's for signage, telling me what signage to have made, etc) but I got none of that.

Like Dean Thompson, I am fed up with having good ideas amount to nothing. At this point I am not sure if I am going to race with the club this year or if I am just going to head down to the Ridge and ORP with Ross and other track day people where I feel I get better bang for my buck with less politics and aggravation.

 

It was an interesting attempt at enticing spectators to stay until the last race of the day (we wouldn't draw until just before the last superbike race) and get them walking through the pits trying to find the free stuff. Perhaps this is a way to get more spectators to come out, a chance to win something that applies to bikes/racing? I felt the best part was when the corner-workers would come through and enter the raffle and then win. Was a great way to say a quick hello and thanks for helping out.

As far as the work that the club needs to get done to race every weekend, it's a tough situation. There will always be that group of folks who feel entitled enough to not help out and it is not likely to change since it is hard to change human behaviour. Perhaps if there were more people who were invested in making the club a success, rather than just a user, it would change that behaviour? I like the direction the executive is going with committees for rules and competition, as long as it isn't the executive also in those positions. I understand Mike T has the arduous task of being the set-up guy, but what if there was more than one person responsible? A committee of folks that are responsible for set-up that doesn't include the executive. That way the exectutive gets a break and others recognize the work involved in set-up and tear down? I suspect that is harder than it seems...

Like Ross, this is no way an attempt at pissing anyone off, but if the same people are doing all the work and complaining about not having enough help, are they actually allowing others to help? Or has it become a burden they must bear and are just resigned to that fact? I have no specifics so this isn't directed at anyone, just commenting on the possibility of human nature being what it is.

Merry Christmas everyone! 2 more sleeps until the kids get to play in the kind of snow that doesn't turn to rain a day later!!!

 

this is way better then watching Oprah at work.